TEACHERS DISCUSSION FORUM
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#1 Parent Rheno747 - 2006-05-28
You're right, Ying - Teachers Discussion

You're right, Ying. Considering I hate capitalism and what 'runaway' capitalism has done to America and good jobs there (thank you, Reagan), I won't stay long if I go back home. It won't be long before I start looking for a TESOL job in Venezuela.

#2 Parent Rheno747 - 2006-05-28
A "TESOL Legend" in Thailand - Teachers Discussion

You've heard of urban legends? Well there is a "TESOL" legend in Thailand.

It goes something like this:

Once there was a farang teacher teaching English at Thammasat University. Once he had a class in which the Prince of Thailand's daughter was enrolled. This girl didn't know crap and the teacher failed her. This teacher was given a "talking to" that made him aware of the fact that he couldn't just fail her. He refused to pass her nevertheless. His corpse was found not long after.

Is there a connection between this teacher's death and his 'warning'? Maybe. Maybe not. Maybe he was wrapped up in the drug trade. Maybe he was making porno videos of underage boys on the side. Maybe the tooth fairy ran over him. Maybe Jim Thompson's ghost killed him.

What makes me pissed off more than the prospect of this guy being killed because he simply was doing his job is the fact that, if true, the spineless farang here would accept it and go to class tomorrow morning like it was just hunky-dory. They should be going on strike and maybe even leaving en masse if true.

#3 Parent Yingwen Laoshi - 2006-05-28
You're not going anywhere, Bro! - Teachers Discussion

There's certainly a lot wrong with TESOL and it can be really frustrating at times, but I still like it a lot.

Yeah, I could go back to London and get myself a job pushing a pen in an office from 9 to 5 everyday. I'm sure I wouldn't be any worse of financially either. But would I be happier?

I still get a rush out of interacting for ninety minutes or so with thirty or fourty Chinese students, doing my best to help them not just learn English, but some positive skills and an attitude that will help them in their future life. Until that rush disappears I'm staying in ESL. It's definitely by FAR the most fulfilling job I've had in my life. Yes, I have a lot of challenges both inside and outside the classroom sometimes, but I always try and focus on my students and my teaching. That's where most of my enjoyment comes from.

If I had a penny for everytime I said to my girlfriend, " That's it! I've had enough I'm leaving China!", I'd be a millionare. Although I often complain about a lot of things here, deep down I still like it and still find the culture, my job and life here interesting. I've left the rat race behind in England and have no desire to return to it at the moment.

I don't know you Rheno, but I have learnt a lot about you from your posts. I think you have similar sentiments as myself and you don't really want to go back. The fact that you always earnestly post about your experiences and frustrations here is testament to how much you care about TESOL. Even if you do go back to the U.S, it won't be long until you come back.

TESOL is a part of you. It's in your blood. You have unfinished business here. You're not going anywhere, Bro'!

#4 Parent Raoul Duke - 2006-05-27
'Scuse Me While I Kiss The Sky - Teachers Discussion

Amen, brethren!

I would add "Fear" to the list. A lot of teachers are a bit afraid of the owners...and maybe not entirely without justification. They fear everything from being unable to find future employment, to difficulties in leaving the country again, to outright physical injury in some back alley somewhere.

It's a card not all schools will refure to play. I've heard a few accounts of dark hints given about what can happen to teachers who don't "play ball" with the schools. I personally have had schools threaten to cancel my Residence Permit...which I knew was a bluff because I had my RP safely in my own possession, rendering it impossible for the school to cancel it.

Of course, in reality there isn't all that much bad stuff that a school can do to you...they can inconvenience you but they can't really hurt you much. They have little bearing on your next job. They can't make you a prisoner of the country and not let you go home. Denying you a release letter is generally illegal and can usually be easily sidestepped with a quick trip to Hong Kong.

Hell, even taking you out and having you whacked is going to call down more hassle upon their heads than they'll ever seriously want to challenge.

And, words perhaps we should all have tattooed onto our foreheads or something: "EFL Teaching is a Seller's Market (at least in East Asia)." What that means is that for every job you have, there will be 500 out there who'd love to have you working there. And what THAT means is there ain't a goddam thing to ever fear about losing a job here. Especially not a bad one.

As for the others, Yingwen, I'm as mystified as you are. How people can NOT stand up for themselves is simply beyond my ability to imagine. I agree...a lot of the problems in this business come from the behavior of those who have gone before us.

#5 Parent Rheno747, B.A., M.A., PhD, Hard Knocks U - 2006-05-27
Agreed. Don't put up with broken promises. - Teachers Discussion

One broken promise today will mean five tomorrow. And twenty next week. Nip this problem in the bud and don't go to work at a school where you notice even one thing isn't what you were promised. You don't have to settle. Don't be somebody's latest fool.

#6 Parent Rheno747, B.A., M.A., PhD, Hard Knocks U - 2006-05-27
Classic Post, Ying - Teachers Discussion

Great post, brother. I howled in laughter as I read it!

Forget the safari tours. Most of the desperate types are the dumbasses who come to these jobs already flat broke. If I ever ran into one of these idiots I think I'd tar and feather his idiot ass.

Some have recently gotten out of a Chinese jail someplace and need a job to pay for the plane ticket they at the moment can't afford.

Yeah, this is something I've been scratching my head over since about my second week in TESOL. Why the hell do these people put up with the abuse these schools dole out? And for every complainer, there's probably five whom you don't hear about.

Screw this TESOL business. It's filled with too many spineless losers. I'm going back home and getting a real job.

#7 Parent Yingwen Laoshi - 2006-05-26
Crosstown Traffic - Teachers Discussion

I hear you, Raoul.You're right of course about getting out of town. That's what I do if they go back on a deal. I tolerated it once, but never again. I learnt my lesson.

Two questions:

1. Why do FTs sign contracts that they're not happy with, and then bitch about it on the Internet?

2. Why do FTs stick around for months and sometimes years with schools that blatantly break the contract and make their life a hell, and then bitch about it on the Internet?

Don't get me wrong. I appreciate teachers that alert us to bad schools. That is one of the purposes of this type of forum. But I think many FTs actually create these monsters (cheating schools) by providing a market for them. Signing on the proverbial dotted and agreeing, when the conditions are pretty poor is not helping ANYONE. It's obviouly not helping the FT who has just commited himself to a year of drudgery and tears. It's not going to help the future FTs. When they turn up for negotiation, the school boss will say "What do you mean 250 dollars a month is not enough?, the previous FT signed!" It won't help, the school itself, because they will never be able to keep permanent, secure and happy teachers, and it sure as hell won't help the poor students. You are making Frankensteins! Many of these scummy, scammy schools are created by FTs!

So WHY do some FTs sign these contracts? I can only think of two main reasons:

Desperation and naivety!

Desperation!...Many school leaders can SMELL the desperation on an FT. They can SEE it in their faces. They can FEEL the reek of anxiety in the air...They can HEAR it bouncing of the walls. They KNOW this poor fool has nothing but holes in his pocket because he's either slashed it all up the wall or just finished his Asian Safari tour, and he is now absolutely SKINT!! YES, the Vultures have primed meat in their sights, and what chance does the poor FT have? He'd just caught a glimpse of bundles of pinkies (100 RMB notes, the highest value Chinese currency in circulation), through the windows of the financial department. Money earned from the blood, sweat and tears of the previous poor deperadoes whose corpses were now buried in the green at the back. He knows this, but his belly is emptier than an off-licence just robbed by a crowd of alcoholics, so he knows that even if the contract states that he has to teach in five schools from sun-up to sunset, he needs to put his scrawl on it pretty soon.

Foreign teacher brethren, stop selling yourselves into modern slavery. Keep a little dosh put away to give yourself that bit of leverage. They can spot the desperadoes a mile away (the ten gallon hat and horse is usually a big giveaway).

Naivety! We've already talked about prime meat, but now the school can smell FRESH virgin meat. Yes the newbie has just arrived fresh of the plane, a lamb to the slaughter.'3000 yuan a month' He'd been told, by e-mail, 'Ten times as much as the locals earn. A bowl of noddles costs 3 RMB a day and a beer is often cheaper'. 'See beautiful China. Come and experience Chinese culture'. Yeah!, He's sure going to experience Chinese culture alright.

It's true though that signing a GOOD contract is no guarantee to a happy trouble-free teaching experience. So what about when an FTs fourteen hour schedule a week, 600$ a month job, suddenly turns into a sixty hour week with a 50% cut in salary? Why do many FTs tolerate this instead of running for the hills? The same as above! STILL desperation, because our poor desperate FT, four months into his contract is still skint! What little salary he has left every month (30% a month is held back as a deposit, he had no choice in this, remember?), has been spent on fags (that means cigarettes in Britain, if you're wondering), and booze, so he feels obligated to accept his revised schedule, besides 'he's doing it for the students'! As for our newbie, he thinks this is the way it is meant to be here, and he also thinks that nothing can be done about it, and of course he's also doing it for th... So naivety again as well. But there's also a third reason.

Illegality!

Some FTs are working illegally, and feeling insecure about their status they daren't seek legal help (understandably,... excuse me Mr FAO, I've been working illegally for this illegal school for the last six months and..).

Brethren, if you turn up at a school and they offer you a bad contract, and they refuse to negotiate reasonably, leave.

If you turn up at a school and they ask you to work on an illegal visa, get back on the train.

If you are WORKING at a school and they suddenly mess you around seriously with your contract, especially regarding your salary and schedule, first firmly but POLITELY reason with them pointing out their promises in the contract. If that doesn't work seek legal help from the local authorities. In China that would be the PSB or the FAO. You could even seek advice from a lawyer. If all of that fails, get the hell out of there. By then the contract will be void and non-existent, because they would have clearly broken it and have made no effort to correct things. But don't leave until you have been paid all you were entitled too.

Whatever you do, do not sign another contract that is worse than the one you already have. I'm talking about contracts that are meant to supersede currently existing ones. If they insist after you have exhausted all negotiation and official help, run for the hills! Don't let these schools be like a traffic jam. Don't get trapped in them.

For every bad school in Asia, there's a much better one around the corner. No school leader holds a gun to your head, unless you give him the gun. Really, there are NO abusive schools, just those who ALLOW themselves to be abused.

So, if we read a post about an FT complaining that his school told him to hurl himself of a ten-storey building through a plate-glass window and that he is now in hospital with two broken legs, a broken collar-bone and a fractured skull, we'll not only heed his advice and not go to that school, but we'll also know why he hurled himself through the window.

'Poor fellow', people will mutter, 'He must have been either a desperado or a newbie. but then again he might have been doing it for th...

You're just like crosstown traffic
So hard to get through to you
Crosstown traffic
I don't need to run over you
Crosstown traffic
All you do is slow me down
And I got better things on the other side of town

Jimi Hendrix

#8 Parent Raoul Duke - 2006-05-25
Don't Take Altered Deals! - Teachers Discussion

The Key on cases like this is to just not accept an altered deal. (And it adds to my incessant droning about never, ever working with a recruiter...)

If a significant promise has been materially changed, and the owner won't make it right, then just hop back on your train and go elsewhere.

Again, school owners only pull this nonsense because they think they can get away with it. Unfortunately, all too often they're right...

Raoul

#9 Parent Yingwen Laoshi - 2006-05-25
Yeah, and more... - Teachers Discussion

> for me anyway, is that when I'm in the classroom or preparing lesson
> plans, I'm a teacher. The rest of the time I consider myself a
> business man. If its dealing with contracts or agreements with my
> manager, or if its demo classes at companies, proposals for
> prospective clients, I have to look at it as though its business.

> I guess I'm too much of a greedy capitalist American to let any more
> pink and green Maos slip through the fingers of business than
> necessary!

Yep!, all I'm interested in is those pinkies. They're the only notes worth anything here. I think I've become a lot more business-minded since working and living in China. I'm reflecting the mercenary nature of many shopkeepers, businessmen and school owners more each day. Why not? What's good for them is good for us. I say to them "If you want to argue about money, let's get it on"! I'm a businessman too.

There's more to it than that though. If you tell me on the phone that you're going to pay me 5000 RMB for 14-18 classes a month, when I arrive don't tell me that I will only get that amount if I work 18 classes, and that anything less will mean a decrease in salary. Don't tell me that you will pay for utilities, and whan I arrive you say sorry there was a misunderstanding with the recruiter, we DON'T pay utilities.

It,s not just the money for me. I just wish they would mean what they say and ...sigh! You know what I mean!

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