TEACHERS DISCUSSION FORUM
Return to Index › Re sad aftermath of ESL "careers"
#1 Parent formerZhengzhou - 2015-08-17
Re sad aftermath of ESL "careers"

You shouldn't really have problems explaining your absense though. Anymore than I would have difficulty explaining why I moved to Toronto for 2 years - because I was working and learning new skills and becoming more professional (anything any 2 years should be explained as).

Now, why employers would miss the opportunity to hire someone who'd boldly taken on a challenge I don't know but I was lucky enough that after a stint in China I had as nearly my very first interview a manager who was quick to recognize he wanted an overseas expert (at least SOME expertise) and was really happy if I could even speak a little introductory Chinese since that was a great welcome and starting/selling point with Chinese customers. I also explained quite openly I was stalled, bored and actually getting 'soft' in life so yes I really did take on China as a major self-discipline self-awareness shake-up experience to broaden my worldview and he absolutely admired that as valid character strength.

but i feel like I'm one of the luckier ones because I hear and have had the opposite experiences yes. I really do think the 'out-of-the-loop' thing is one of the major issues though. Its crazy but after just a year even my old company had already changed - the old boss was gone, new people, old friends were gone and/or moved departments. So that's only 1 year but I walk back in there 'as if' I was some old strange outsider heh. Imagine 3 or 5 years!

#2 Parent San Migs - 2015-08-14
Re sad aftermath of ESL "careers"

I've heard it described many ways but its like they return to learn the world 'moved on without them'. Indeed, they are even seen as 'dropouts'. As if they lost their place in the queue/line. I remember one describing the 1st question in job interview back in his home country was "Why did you give up working and just run away to China? Were you just tired of your job?". So you see the thinking! Instead of asking "why did you take on a big new challenge requiring so many new skills?" the local employer saw it as if he'd 'dropped out' and they see the 3 years in China as '3 missing years from your CV/resume'.

Agreed. I reckon this is especially true in Western Europe and the western world in general.

1 year teaching in China you could probably get away with, and an employer may even ask if you know any Chinese, but only really give it a cursory glance on your CV and leave it at that. 2 years or longer and there are going to be problems explaining your prolonged absence from your homeland. The people I used to hang out and party with in my early 20's are now married and settled and have good jobs or their own businesses, as you say, you get out of the "loop".

#3 Parent formerZhengzhou - 2015-08-13
Re sad aftermath of ESL "careers"

There does seem to be different categories of scenarios. Young 20-somethings are often not bothered and teaching overseas still adds something to their career chances which are just beginning. A most comfortable type I meet is the older retired teachers or sometimes retired police or sometimes people who have an inheritance or business back home. Often a 55+ man. They aren't bothered if they return or stay. They aren't affected by anything either way.

The people who may not benefit are just as you describe. Maybe they are 35-50. Some divorced or some the type who found they were not getting ahead in life back home and so wanted something to "boost" their skills, experience and they are still young enough to look for a life-changing world experience too. This type often finds themselves staying a little longer. They are still young enough they are likely to find a long-term girlfriend or get married in China. They may even plan for 2 or 3 years.

You guys are right that this type often goes back to their home workforce and to their horrible surprise finds that they now worse off than ever before. It's almost as if they fell out of the loop. I've heard it described many ways but its like they return to learn the world 'moved on without them'. Indeed, they are even seen as 'dropouts'. As if they lost their place in the queue/line. I remember one describing the 1st question in job interview back in his home country was "Why did you give up working and just run away to China? Were you just tired of your job?". So you see the thinking! Instead of asking "why did you take on a big new challenge requiring so many new skills?" the local employer saw it as if he'd 'dropped out' and they see the 3 years in China as '3 missing years from your CV/resume'.

Again, this doesn't seem to affect a 25 or 30 year old as much. It won't effect an older semi-retired person at all.It does seem to work against that age group you described as 40-50 year old 'middle-aged men' and there's even that term 'economic refugees' which is not to say they don't have ANY money or opportunity back home but in a real sense get stuck inside a Chinese teaching career that in itself doesn't translate back home.

Someone else mentioned a good point about social lives too.. at that age these guys (and girls too) but they may often find a parent or parents had passed away while they were in China, family had moved, their old contacts had changed and when they return to their hometown all their 'social structure' and relationships are quite different. Adding to the all mentioned before.

*btw: I returned home after just a year. In that time my grandparents had passed away. Its a strange thing but somehow I expected to return to see my family the same as they always were but instead it was as if everything was so different. Another had moved away. The whole family world had changed and even stranger I came in almost like an 'outsider' in some sense (having gone through none of the year's events). Imagine 3 years!

#4 Parent San Migs - 2015-08-09
Re sad aftermath of ESL "careers"

We have already heard of one story about a 55 year old former ESL teacher. I know of a 50 year old guy from UK in China living on 4000 rmb a month. He has no house or family back in the UK. He has no savings at all. It is hard for him to get teaching work in China. He thought he could possibly marry a wealthy thirty-something Chinese woman to solve his financial woes. No, he has discovered that Chinese women are not interested in low-income Western men. I know of a 47 year old UK guy in a similar predicament. They came to China a long time ago and started teaching. These guys have been advised to move to Japan or Taiwan ( the first guy has advanced degrees including an MA ) but there is another snag for them: They can't afford to relocate. It looks like they are stuck in China with no support at all. If they fail to get more teaching work they are finished, and will end up on the streets.

This is another warning for anyone who thinks ESL is a career option for them. It is not, and if you take notice of anything ESL GW types says you could end up like the two gentlemen I just spoke about.

Thanks for the post, first of all.

I know a guy like you describe who must be around 47 now, all he had when I last knew him was a small training centre with his younger chinese wife, this was going back some years. No degree at all, and nothing at all back in the UK, and he did not seem keen to want to take her back there as he was quite rightly worried she would do a runner and leave him skint and stick in the UK alone, so he chooses to stay on in China, indefinitely, despite hating teaching kids.

There are more older blokes stuck in China, than meets the eye. The GW's will say it is all horseshit, but it is the truth, we, and many others know it.

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