Sorry about this addendum, Martin almighty, but I ran out of time on my last visit here.

Anyway, I know you have an issue on my choice of texts, but you have to understand one thing--my TESOL program didn't provide me with any. This outfit didn't even recommend books.

I also know you have an issue with the book I recommended by David Harris. It's the book on testing. Well, I know the book is old, but chew on this--my TESOL program didn't even cover testing. A book that will run one less than a book on Amazon will be good to take when he gets a TESOL from that outfit. It'll be better than the "nothing" I got fro my 1600 US bucks.

When I started teaching at my fist gig, the first assignment I had was to test my students. I had to test my students because my boss told me to do it. At that moment, I wish I would have had that book by Harris. The book (and subject matter) my TESOL program didn't provide, remember.

And the grammar book? That thing is priceless, cuss. It's a Princeton review text that won't go out of style until English grammar goes out of style.

Wiedersehen.

Information is valuable .. as you say. And it's great that you're giving up your time etc to advise others. But I think you could really do with taking your own advice to heart and aiming to make your own postings on the subject a good deal more informative.

For instance, you advise people (everyone, everywhere?) to take a cheap online teaching cert on the basis that it 'works fine'. What is that supposed to mean anyway? The problem is that what works 'fine' for one person in one place might be a complete waste of time for someone somewhere else. Someone wanting to work in a good language school in Italy, the UK, Australia, New Zealand etc etc will find their online cert of limited use, I think. And in many other countries, eg Brazil, the newbie teacher may actually get trained up for nothing by one of the langauge school groups there (eg Seven, Yazigi etc). Something they'll probably have to do anyway, even if they do have an online cert. So your advice will have cost them 300 bucks for nothing. It's a big world out there and there's a lot that you - and everyone else working in the field - doesn't know. If your advice is really limited to your experience in one or two countries then I think you should actually say that in your posting before sounding off as if you've been appointed King of the World of TEFL!

You also mention three books you claim every TESOL teacher should have. Again, on the basis of what?! The "essential" book you mention, for instance, was, I think, written in the late sixties. Now there's nothing wrong with that in itself - and Mary Finocchiaro has written some very good stuff in her very long career - but I still wonder what makes you believe that's still the outstanding methodology book to recommend to new teachers more than 30 years later. What are its unique qualities that set it apart from the scores of other introductory books on the subject? And what contexts might it be more or less useful in? The same basically can be said about your other hot tips. There's nothing wrong with you saying you found the book interesting or useful or whatever in YOUR EXPERIENCE. But the 'every teacher must have it because .. I said so' .. is a pretty thin basis for advice, don't you think?

Elsewhere you claim that "in most cases" teachers with a certificate will ONLY get jobs teaching younger learners. Again, what do you base this on? I'll have to say here, I just don't agree. I've worked in quite a few schools in various countries with certificate qualified teachers working with adults. I've also been involved in courses in which hundreds of teachers have gained TEFL certificates. I haven't heard of a single case of one of these teachers having to teach children because they weren't able to gain employment teaching adults with their certificate. Moreover, the several hundred accredited English schools in the UK, Australia, New Zealand for instance, are staffed predominantly by certificate qualified teachers - working with adult learners. Indeed, I'm sure you know that the 'A' of 'CELTA' stands for 'Adults' - so it would be a bit odd if most teachers who did this qualification went on to work with younger learners.

And just a word about your advice on getting an MA in TESOL. Could you maybe wait until you've actually done that yourself before recommending it as a kind of panacea for TESOL teacher woes? Like everything else, whether or not an MA is the right decision for person X depends on a range of different things. Obviously, anyone deciding to spend one or two years and many thousands of dollars on an MA ought to think very carefully about the cost-benefit aspect of their decision and what kinds of work they'll be prepared for. MA courses vary considerably. The one I did was entirely theoretical - I learnt a good deal about conducting and writing up research - but very little about classroom teaching. And no I didn't find the doors flung open to me after the course. In terms of respect and job opportunities, I've found that other factors - eg personal connections, my first degree etc - have carried as much if not more weight in the area of language teaching. It's not really until my current job - 14 years later - that my MA really counted. And in terms of content, it's probably been most useful as a basis for further research as part of a doctorate. Ironically, though, these are taking me away from language teaching rather than serving as an entry into it!

Anyway, I'm certainly not discouraging anyone from taking an MA. They need to think about their plans and also look into the details of the many many courses on offer. But there's no point in seeing their MA as some kind of Aladdin's magic lamp to summon up the dream career. It ain't.

And one last point.. you make various insinuations about the 'interested types' who stalk these boards to sucker the newbies into their overpriced courses. But you do so from behind the mask of anonymity. I think that if you really want to make a point about openness and transparency, you ought to consider identifying yourself. Otherwise, it's all masks, isn't it?

Martin McMorrow
University Learning Advisor, New Zealand
CELTA and DELTA course assessor

In a free market, information is valuable. Let me provide some information here. If you're somebody who's thinking about getting into TESOL, take heed. Let me tell you the best way to get into TESOL, my friends and colleagues:

1. Go CHEAP on the cert, if you need one at all. I can't emphasize this enough. Do not pay several hundreds, even several thousands, on a mere TESOL program that may even require you to fly (via expensive, non-reimbursed airfare) to an overseas location. There are online programs that will work just fine, such as ICAL's. To complement an online program, be sure to get three great books every TESOL teacher should have: "Teaching English as a Second Language" by Mary Finocchiaro, "Master the Basics of English" by Jean Yates, and "Testing English as a Second Language" by David Harris. All three are available at Amazon for good prices. Going this route will allow you to "test drive" TESOL for a little while to make sure you actually like it, not to mention learn a lot more about TESOL than you will at a program. TESOL is just too risky to just "jump in" without knowing what you're getting into. You may like it, but you may not. Make sure you ask all your questions and get the answers before getting on the airplane.

2. Watch out for the "interested types" on websites such as this. These folks have a stake in seeing that you are herded into an expensive TESOL cert program you may not need. Remember that a mere TESOL certificate will be able to get only jobs teaching younger learners (in most cases), as this type of job is in high demand. This is because the experienced guys already know that teaching young kids is a drag and don't accept such jobs, hence their availibility and "ease" to get. Sure, some people actually enjoy teaching young kids, but most don't. Why pay through the nose for a program that limits your choices later? Why pay big money for a program that limits you to jobs you don't want?

3. If you REALLY want to do the TESOL thing, get a master's degree in TESOL instead of a cert or a diploma. You'll be much more qualfied, have more credibility, and will treated with more respect. It'll also be a lot easier for you to change jobs if a school abuses you. Yeap, you'll be able to qualify for much better jobs later and won't have to settle for those jobs teaching young kids--the jobs no experienced teachers want (for good reason). You'll also have more freedom to walk away from a school and land another job easily and quickly if you indeed have to walk away.

Good luck.