esl in asia
- 2005-01-02
Nice cut and paste job. Too bad you don't understand nor read what you copied. Ah...the American educational system is to blame. Now I get it. Thats why so many of you march off to the war drum. You have no historical perspective
C and T
- 2004-12-31
Canadians sponsoring foreign spouses pay much more, wait more than a year for working visas, etc, etc....
Much easier to enter-live in the US than Canada. Canadians overprotect their all for all health care system, which the US does not have.
Consider yourself lucky to be doing this in the US.
Eric
- 2004-12-31
I know plenty of legal immigrants, why is it so dificult for you and your huspand?
You show proof of marriage, you get a fiance visa for three months, get married in the states and file the paperwork with the INS. Not so difficult.
Dos
- 2004-12-31
They want to do it legally. Sounds foolish I know, but some people want to do the 'right' thing.
Trouble is, 'they' punish people for doing the 'right' thing, and the people who don't bother get away with it.
Good luck with your visas!
Eric
- 2004-12-31
Why is it so difficult for your British huspand to get in the country and work?
It is not so difficult for all the Indians, Latinos, East Europeans, and Orientals, why for him?
The Observer
- 2004-12-31
whilst you are learning so much, could you please take a spelling course. Blimy!!
Maria
- 2004-12-31
HI ,
I am presently enrolled in the TESL Canada diploma course in Toronto , reasearched the whole TEFL process and opted for the year course .
CELTA is offerred in canada www.tesl.ca
also ,
I do not recommend it to anyone to go and teach overseas or wherever your heart desires without obtaining propper training . My mind has been blown away , by some of things I am learning and will be contuing to learn , An absolute life changing experince .
If all goes as planned , I hpe to be in Greece come summer
Happy New Year to all
William Box
- 2004-12-31
All these things and more.
Actually, you Brits have for the past century or so wrung the last farthing from just about every undeveloped nation in the Middle East and parts of Asia, thereby creating multifaceted problems for America to correct.
The only thing to come out of GB recently that had balls is the "Iron Maiden." The Ol Girl had more between her legs than most men! The greatest MAN to come out of Britain was a WOMAN! The next pint I drink will be to Lady Margaret Thatcher.
Now to Britiana.
India.
Why didn't British Lord Mountbatten settle the issue of Kashmir once and for all when he was Governor General of India. As Viceroy he had the power. Now, we're stuck with two nuclear nations each laying claim to the same piece of land and continually rattling their atomic swords.
Middle East.
Iraq.
He added: "We are today not far from a disaster." Sound familiar? That was T. E. Lawrence Lawrence of Arabia writing in The Sunday Times of London on Aug. 22, 1920, about the British occupation of what was then called Mesopotamia. And he knew. For it was Lieutenant Colonel Lawrence and the intrepid British adventuress Gertrude Bell who, more than anyone else, were responsible for the creation of what was to become Iraq. A fine mess they made of it, too. (By John Kifner)
Iraq was partitioned by Britain without regard to tribal affilication, language, culture, religion and socio-economic conditions.
Palestine.
What was the purpose of the British Mandate for Palestine?
By this document, the British government was made responsible for the territory known as Palestine for the specific purpose of facilitating Jewish immigration, settlement, and the establishment of a "national home for the Jewish people". While it is noted that the "civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine" shall not be prejudiced by the purpose of the Mandate, the clear intent was to go forward with the Zionist program of Jewish immigration and settlement.
Unfortunately for all parties, early optimism that this could be done with justice for all was destroyed by Arab hostility to the basic concept, however implemented, and increasing anti-Jewish violence from the Arabs as the Mandate period proceeded. Ultimately the British reneged on their obligations and adopted a largely pro-Arab approach to policies in the Mandate territory.
China: The Opium War--1839-42
In the nineteenth century, Chinese green tea became very popular among Europeans and Americans. Chinese silk and porcelain were also in great demand. The Chinese, on the other hand, needed almost nothing the west had to offer. This created an imbalance of trade, especially bad for the British, who were weary of sending shiploads of silver to Hong Kong. Their solution was to develop a third-party trade: exchanging their merchandise in India and Southeast Asia for cotton and opium, welcomed in China as currency, in spite of the Imperial Chinese prohibition on opium. (Opium is a preparation made from the juice of poppy seed pods, and is where heroin comes from.) During the early 1800's opium addiction reached epidemic proportions in China, after the British began using it instead of money. Even the upper command of the Imperial army were 'stupid and besotted,' not to mention badly hooked.
Your charge that the U.S. is in it for the "Oil" is valid to a point. Oil is a precious commodity these days. Even more so as the years pass and it becomes more scarce. However, the problem is infinitely more complicated than just a few million barrels of oil. The entire damned region is a powder keg.
West vs East. Islam vs Christianity. Poor vs Rich. Democracy vs Dictatorial Rule. Seemingly, the whole world vs America.
GET MY DRIFT, HERE? The Colonialists (especially Britain) globe trotted around the world, screwing it up, and sat on their ill gotten booty and waited for America to clean up their mess.
This already being a rather lengthy piece, I'll spare everyone the agony of telling you everything you don't know about Iraq and America's involvment in it.
I apologize for this unabashedly patriotic diatribe and I'll put my soapbox under the bed. Thank you and good night.
Regards to all
and a happy and properous New Year!
Michaelangello
- 2004-12-30
Yeah, the CELTA course is great, especially if you have about $2000USD to burn on this course.
I don't agree at all with the comment of British English being taught for those reasons. There should be an international board composed of 5 major Universities, each from one of the major English speaking nations. This board of 5 Universities should decide on an international standard of English to be taught, and they should develope their own program and certificate course, NOT just Cambridge.
You dont need CELTA to learn the difference between British and North American English, there are many books where you can learn the differences. i.e. Oxford, Webster's, Cambridge, TOEFL... your coworkers from other nations...
Yeah, CELTA is extremely useful in the EU since the British have locked the market there, but notice in the far East no one really cares what kind of certificate you have , just that you have one.
Again, there should be 5 Universities that decide and make the international program for ESl and certification. For example ( Cambridge, George Washington Uni, U of Auckland, U of Sydney, and U of British Columbia) NOT JUST CAMBRIDGE!!!!
blaize
- 2004-12-28
you are soooooooo "ferpectly right"! i'm an american and just recently married a british man. we came back to america for the wedding. he had to endure all the eye-scanning, dna-processing (swab from inside if cheek), finger-printing, etc. just to get in the country, yet i've never had to deal with any of that in any of the countries i've ever visited.
now, onto the work visa...we are legally married, i have been an american citizen since birth, and so on. i thought the visa procedure would be somewhat straight-forward. how wrong i was...
he is still unable to work, get a drivers license, register for university clesses, etc. we've applied for the visa, done all the paperwork and even hired a lawyer to simplify things, yet still no visa yet. have been told it will take another 2 months on top of the 2 months we've been waiting. the visa application alone cost $745. he also had to have a full medical evaluation done by the civil surgeon which cost over $300.
i had no problems of any kind getting work or studying any any of the coutries i've resided in/visited, but yet my own husband has difficulty after difficulty.
is it any wonder the EU makes it so difficult for americans to work in europe?
blaize
- 2004-12-28
i'm an american and had no problems finding places to do my CELTA course, which i completed summer 2002. i found places in the states and in canada that offer the CELTA, but ultimately decided to go to London for the CELTA.
i compared prices for the CELTA course in north america versus the price in the UK and found that even adding in the airfare, it was about the same price.
so not only was i trained by british teachers, i got to experience living in london.
another added benefit to studying in the UK is that most english language schools everywhere teach british english grammar and pronunciation, which i learned from studying in the UK. schools want british english because all the english exams are regulated by the UK.
when i later took on a teaching position in poland, i had more lessons and private lessons than other more experienced teachers because i was able to teach both forms of english (british and american), which put more money in my pocket. 
i also feel that doing the CELTA course in another country helped prepare me for the experience of moving abroad. i learned valuable lessons about how the european continent lives, which is quite different from north america, especially greensboro, north carolina, usa.
all in all, i think that doing the course in the UK is definitley worth the extra expense.
Michaelangello
- 2004-12-12
Comrade,
That was some nice sarcasm.
But, really, I never said they Can Not speak English, I simply said in our profession of ESL, we only consider the people from the following countries true native English speakers:
USA, Canada, UK, Austraila, and New Zealand, sometimes South Africa, but not so often.
notice there are no advertisements asking for teachers from the Bahamas, Jamaica, or British Virgin Islands, even though they speak English.
What about the Austrailian dialect, Americans, Brits, Irish, Scots, and Canadians also have dialects...
The Observer
- 2004-12-08
My thesis has been destroyed by your exquisitely structured, thoroughly researched and scientifically impeccable argument.
From now on I will tell all my Middle Eastern, African, South and East Asian, Western and Northern European etc etc friends that they cannot speak English. (By the way -I'm not sure - is this the Permission "can", or the Ability "can" you are using here?).
Unfortunately because I cannot speak any of the many other languages they can speak,I will have to tell them in English.
I'm sure they'll understand.
ps. please come and have a beer with some of my Australian friends and so enlighten them as to your analysis of the "dialect" of English that they speak. I'm sure they'll be grateful!
Michaelangello
- 2004-12-07
No, you can not count those countries because most nations do not consider many of those countries true speakers of English.
It is most commonly accepted that the UK, USA, Canada, Austraila, New Zealand, and sometimes South Africa are considered true English speaking countries.
If you notice most English schools are not looking for teachers from the Bahamas or one of the many African Nations.
Count the population of the countries that are considered true native speakers of English. You can't consider people from India as speakers of British Engish, and you can't count people from Saudi Arabia as speakers of North American English. Only count the countries that the majority of ESL teachers are from, which are: UK, USA, Canada, Austraila, and New Zealand. The are many foreigners in all of these countries that are not native speakers, so it equals out. And as you can see, the numbers are in the majority of North American style English.
North American Style English: English dialect spoken in Canada and United States.
Queen's English: Style of English spoken in the UK.
Most Austrailains speak a dialect of Queen's English.
The Observer
- 2004-12-06
ok i go back to my original statement. you tried to make the claim that most english speakers in the world speak north american style english whatever the *&&% that is.
absolute garbage.
now youre trying to prove it by having me compare populations? so i'm not allowed to count countries in which English is not an official language, is that what youre trying to say? that seems a bit rude when a significant proportion of people in north america do not speak english as their first language.
how about countries in which english is spoken either as an official language or one in which it is spoken by a significant proportion of the population? there's a list below. DO THE MATH as they apparently say in that minor linguistic variety you are apparently so fond of.
there are more English speakers in India and Pakistan alone than there are in North America, while Malaysia and Singapore arent even in this list for some reason (never mind all those people scandinavian and other european countries who grow up speaking English). Dream on, or get a life and pull your head out that yankee flag bag youve got it stuck in.
Antigua and Barbuda
Australia
Bahamas,The
Bangladesh
Barbados
Belize
Bermuda
Botswana
Brunei
Cameroon
Canada
Cayman Islands
Dominica
Fiji
Gambia,The
Ghana
Gibraltar
India
Ireland
Jamaica
Kenya
Lesotho
Liberia
Malawi
Malta
Mauritius
New Zealand
Nigeria
Pakistan
Papua New Guinea
Philippines
Seychelles
Sierra Leone
South Africa
Sri Lanka
Swaziland
Tanzania
Trinidad and Tobago
Uganda
United Kingdom
United States
Zambia
Zimbabwe
Michaelangello
- 2004-12-06
Well, is that any reason to punish the Canadians and Aussies, because of the United States foreign policy? The EU could be a little more kind at letting Candians and Aussies work there.
Yes, the United States is difficult to get into, but I think the United Kingdom is the same or close to it. I think that is a more accurate comparision, rather than comparing the USA to the EU. The USA is made up of States. The EU is made up of many countries, not an equal comparision.
Michaelangello
- 2004-12-06
Simple fact, just compare the populations of the countries, and see which one adds up to the most. And only count the countries that are considered native English speakers.
Dos
- 2004-12-01
I am sure the UK doesn't 'supply' teachers to the North either, they likely supply 'themselves'. If you are so concerned, why don't you go and teach their?
Perhaps England introduced slavery to the US, but it also abolished it before the US did. The South didn't want to get rid of it at all of course did they?
You seem to have a bit of a chip on your shoulder, do you work abroad? You seem to be the sort of person that gives American teachers here the bad image they often have. Lighten up and open your mind a little. America isn't the only country in the world you know, despite their best efforts. 
gharwell1
- 2004-11-30
Sudan supplies over 12% of China's Oil needs as it is.
there are jobs in Sudan. You never see them posted but they are there. Only in the North though. Why doesn't the UK provide teachers to the South. It was their colony before. Could it be that they are Black.
Look what the UK has done for people...
Well, they left us with Sudan and their misery. They left us with Uganda and Idi Amin. They introduced Slavery to North America and fortunately the US got rid of it. Granted it took 75 years after it became a country but it WAS introduced by the UK.
esl in asia
- 2004-11-30
I agree with you about all the stupid heavy-handiness in the US. But immigration is still pretty easy compared to Europe. Actually, all those rules existed long before the neo-cons took over AmeriKa.
Europe has always been protectionist in its labour market. Im 39 and I worked in Germany back in 1986. I doubt Europe would be less slack even if the US were handing out visas to anyone that wanted them... not that many Europeans would want a US visa these days...but hey.
However, like you said, for vacationers and travellers to the US, things are pretty reminiscent of Big Brother (especially from certain countries). That retinal scan and fingerprinting stuff is pretty intrusive. Even with all that, getting a job in the US is pretty easy. Sponsorship or just working illegally is easy. Try working illegally in Germany.
The Observer
- 2004-11-30
I think you'll find that your claim that the majority of people in the world speak North American-style English (whatever that is) has no basis in fact, even if we do restrict our considerations only to those people of the world who speak what would generally be considered to be some variety of English.
Sorry. My last post was a little strident, and I can't work out how to delete it.
Ferpectly right
- 2004-11-30
You say that Americans can't work in the EU without visas, what about the other way around? You can even GET INTO the US now without having eyeball scans and whatnot it seems, and if your name happens to be similiar to some 'suspect' then expect to have a nice chat to some big fellows in dark glasses for a few hours before your flight, should they allow you on.
EU members have to get a work permit for the US as well you know. You stop that, maybe the EU will drop their requirements.
Tit-tat and all that.
esl in asia
- 2004-11-30
Actually, an American would say:
We wouldn't do that in Merikee/Cannukeeville, Huh. Yes, the huh ending is quite popular. It reminds me of the military when all they do is grunt huh. The Canadians say eh, a vestige of the British.
Colloquialisms are not why you cant teach in the EU. Its pure labour related. The British and Irish are EU citizens, ergo, they can work in the EU. Yanks, Aussys, and Kiwis are not EU citizens, so they can not.
Its a labour protection issue and has nothing to do with eh, Huh, or British tags. Also, lets face it, Britain and Ireland are closer and will fill the bulk of the need of English teachers. As an American, I presume, you understand the supply side of that in economics terms Im sure.
esl in asia
- 2004-11-30
Yes, and under British occupation, the Indian empire got a good train system. Did that stop Ghandi?
Well, Im not going to get into politics, as this is a teachers board. I just said what I did because, if you are looking for work in Germany and are American, you may have a problem because all the lovely things you listed are not on the Europeans list.
Also, Im not talking about the official governments stance, but the masses of people. I should know, since I lived there.
Actually, many of those things you listed are true but it is a payoff for oil that the US desperately needs, if it is to compete with China.
Now there are two main countries that are major oil consumers: China and the US. Yes, Virginia, there is an oil problem and the US knows it. Ergo, enter Iraqi and remove a bad guy ( never mind that there are bad guys in some African countries....Oh wait..the Sudan has oil). 
gharwell1
- 2004-11-29
Although the coalition is ina war to free Iraq from tyranny and apart from discovering around 300,000 bodies in Mass Graves and aapart from finding 1200 teachers and students in one Mass Grave and apart from Saddam gassing whole villages in the Northern Kurdish area and the marsh arabs in the south,..... there are some other facts that should be looked at.
* Over 400,000 kids have up-to-date immunizations.
* School attendance is up 80% from levels before the war.
* Over 1,500 schools have been renovated and rid of the weapons
stored there so education can occur.
* The port of Uhm Qasar was renovated so grain can be off-loaded
from ships faster.
* The country had its first 2 billion barrel export of oil in August.
* Over 4.5 million people have clean drinking water for the first time ever
in Iraq.
* The country now receives 2 times the electrical power it did before the
war
* 100% of the hospitals are open and fully staffed, compared to 35% before
the war
* Elections are taking place in every major city, and city councils are in
place.
* Sewer and water lines are installed in every major city.
* Over 60,000 police are patrolling the streets.
* Over 100,000 Iraqi civil defense police are securing the country.
* Over 80,000 Iraqi soldiers are patrolling the streets side by side with US
soldiers.
* Over 400,000 people have telephones for the first time ever.
* Students are taught field sanitation and hand washing techniques to
prevent the spread of germs.
* An interim constitution has been signed.
* Girls are allowed to attend school.
* Textbooks that don't mention Saddam are in the schools for the first time
in 30 years.
GEEEEEE...I guess all these things are bad....
gharwell1
- 2004-11-29
Of course it would be better if all the borders were opened up to all English Teachers. I like the concept but the reality is quite different.
It seems that EU Teachers use a lot of tag endings when talking with people. It's power through Exclusion. "We wouldn't do that in London now would we..."
Where North American teachers would say something like, "We wouldn't do that in Merikee/Cannukeeville. Which one is best? Nobody knows....... I have seen good and bad teachers from both places.
It seems that by blocking everyone out that the EU seems to be more ethnocentric. You have to make your own informed decision.
Gary Harwell
The Observer
- 2004-11-29
> the majority of people in the world are speakers of North American style English.
Absolute rubbish.
esl in asia
- 2004-11-29
Here, here.
Ive complained to deaf ears about this too. I too found it quite a shame that Canada is chock full of Brits but we cant go there to work.
The EU, as I mentioned is a protectionist society to help from squeezing labour. Yes, the Brits do have the ESL market locked in. But do you really know why?
It's because the British government has funded the British Council to promote the English language in Europe and abroad whereas the Americans just sat on their hands.
Americans are too cheap basically to fund anything but bombs. So the British government set aside a lot of money to promote English training and their programs. Sorry, but you have the Canadians/Americans to blame for that.
You just have to except it and play by the rules. Get your CELTA/Trinity in the EU and be done with it. Then, look for work in Germany, as they still hire N. Americans. Well, maybe not Americans these days but thats not because of the labour issue, if you get my drift.
Complaining will not change the rigid Europeans with their proverbial rod up their bum. I wish you the best of luck in what ever is your decision.
Michaelangello
- 2004-11-29
Yes, you are right, you can get a CELTA certification in the EU also, not just the UK. But, that doesn't make it any easier. You still have to pay a high price for a certificate and you still must pay for aeroplane flights to these destinations from Canada, USA, or Australia.
I don't think it is a very objective statement to say that the UK has a better education system. Remember it only takes 2 years to earn a BA in the UK and it takes 4 years to earn one in North America. Also, I suppose it all depends on the school/university you go to.
Schools should give all English teachers from English speaking countries equal opportunity. More programs should be offered by the large schools like EF to train teachers at VERY low cost(no more than 150 euros for a certfication course for teachers who sign a one-year contract with the school).
It would be nice!
Michaelangello
- 2004-11-29
Thank you Gary. But, don't you think there should be more equal opportunity for all English teachers from English speaking countries? The EU passport requirement and CELTA seem like an easy excuse for the UK to keep a firm grasp over most of the ESL market in the world. This is puzzling to me why does the UK have most of the market, when the majority of people in the world are speakers of North American style English.
Michaelangello
- 2004-11-29
Yes, you should take the necessary classes to learn how to teach English, but that was not the question. The question was why is CELTA required by many big schools? Why not accept more than just CELTA teaching certifications? In Canada, USA, and Australia it is not so easy to go to the EU or UK to take a 4-week course in CELTA. There should be more options and opportunities for all English teachers from all English speaking countries to have equal opportunity.
Caroline
- 2004-11-28
English language--England---CELTA or maybe University Degree---Bachelor--English Philology is better.How can you teach if you don't know how to do it ?Your mother tongue is not enough and students are intelligent!They can choose their teachers!
esl in asia
- 2004-11-25
Hi Michaelangello,
First, you can get a CELTA or Trinity in Europe and NOT in the bloody U.K. I have a CELTA and it cost 1,500 USD two years ago in Poland. Many schools will offer the course in other European countries. So for example, if you want to teach in Greece, find a school there that has either the CELTA or Trinity. The Trinity Cert-TESOL is the same as the CELTA.
Why does the EU lock out others? Well being a Canadian that lived in the Czech Republic for almost two years, you are right. The Europeans want to protect their labour market. Only the Canadians and Americans have such open arms, not because they love immigrants, but because they want the cost of labour to fall in favour of big corps. Europe is not so dumb.
Anyway, there is hope. Germany will hire Canadians and Americans with a CELTA or Trinity. Also, you could work in Central Europe: Hungary, Poland, Czech Rep. , etc, etc. However, the money is bad in those places. Another idea, you could marry a national. Otherwise, the superior Europeans want you to stay the heck out.
Lastly, you should get your CELTA or Trinity because the training is actually very good. The Brits do a better job at TESOL training... trust me, they do ( -and I dont particularly care for the Brits). My CELTA has opened many doors...it was worth the money.
gharwell1
- 2004-11-25
They feel that their power is derived from what they can deny instead of what they can provide. It's just a basic premise of existence in the EU. What can we deny you?
Gary Harwell
Please, someone explain to me what is with CELTA?
Why do so many schools like EF and IH require you to have CELTA?
CELTA is Cambridge, therefore, it is a British thing. It is difficult for Americans and Canadians to get CELTA certification unless they pay about $2000 and go to one of the special locations which are ussually located in the United Kingdom, how nice, so easy for a Canadian to fly all the way to the UK just to take a CELTA course. SO, why do they make the CELTA course so expensive, and why are there not more places in English speaking countries (excluding UK) that offer the CELTA certificate course? It seems like it is more of an easy excuse for British based companies to indirectly discriminate against not UK citizens.
Also, many places in Europe, like in Germany and Italy require teachers to have an EU passport. I think this is not fair and is a form of discrimination. US and Canadian English schools do not require teachers to have a North American passport only, SO then why do our friends in the EU discriminate against Australian, American, and Candian teachers who do not have EU passports. We are sorry we don't have EU passports, but it is not like we can just buy them on Ebay.
Please, explain, why the UK has a good lock-down on the English School market and won't accept other passports and certificates that are not UK or EU based????? Are they discriminating or just making it very difficult for other English speaking peoples to get jobs conincidently....