Yes been there done that it does totally suck, I agree. I don't attribute one bit of my teaching ability to my education at all, except the education I gave myself along the way to become better at it. Also having a natural gift for it has went a long way. In truth, many people need years, even decades of education just to be as good as someone who has no training but was born with that gift. Let's face it, an average person can go to school for years to become a good dancers, and be trumped by a 7 year old who is naturally talented at it. This is true the world over. Education is great, no question, it can be good for people who have a gift to polish it, or for those who don't to acquire enough skill to at least make a living at something, or maybe not. Either way, those people will likely never be great. I don't knock education, believe me, but there are so many different types of education, hence I honestly do think college education is hyped way too much, touted far too often.The truth is, it one only one of hundreds if not thousands of ways to learn, and it's no more or less impressive than any other. It's a tool, and a good one ideally, but far from the only one. I think that people who are to egocentric and pushy about it's importance are really just plain insecure. Deep down I think they realize it is not that big a deal, but they have nothing else. In truth it could just as easily be said that such people who tout it so much are themselves envious of those who can do without it, or even do better than they. The truth is the world is fully of envious people.

Like I said, education is a great thing, but don't be too proud of the particular education you have gotten, it is one of many different forms in the grand scheme of things. I find it sad people don't take seriously all the other ways of learning out there. People are closed minded often times, because to open their minds would mean casting a possible shadow on their own perceived accomplishments, and they might have to see what they have done isn't all that important.

Whatever the case may be, let's not forget these facts, that there are many different forms of education, and to show more respect for them, even if they are not what you have been taught to perceive as equal to what you have done. That's a foolish preconception to have about a great many things, including education. College isn't all there is out there, and too look down upon others who didn't do what you did to achieve their knowledge is foolish, arrogant, and just plain stupid. Period.

Where I come from, there is no such thing as a college degree. However, there ARE university degrees. But maybe you're on about associate degrees, which aren't deemed proper degrees in the academic world, as they only entail 2 years of full-time study at colleges, not universities. I believe they are only available in O'bama land!

Thanks been there done that, though I never said people formerly educated are snobs or any other such thing. My point though in regards to teaching here was much the same as yours. To teach English in China a degree is necessary. The Chinese don't care about teaching students English, just making money. Even in public schools it's all about making money. You might get a better ride at a public school, better treatment, but it's by no means a guarantee that you will.

Bottom line, for teaching English "here" in China, it's not a relevant issue. They don't even care, it's the government that created what is really a fake measure to make some people happy. It is however a measure that is largely ignored. Preferred is a white face, and not much more really. Also let's be honest, education in western countries is far superior, and someone who was even a good High School student is likely better educated than someone with a BA form a Chinese University. Sad but often true.

Truth is you can't judge a book by it's cover, or it's degree. Degrees these days are not hard to get, anyone who can get a D or above will pass and get one. Not impressive. I have no idea the correlation between having a degree and learning new skills either, as a degree is generally not a degree in any trade skills of any kind. nor does it imply even an innate ability to learn. Need one reference the majority of people who are C students, at best?

In this information age, with so much information readily available, people are far more informed, and with far more resources to improve themselves. Though I'll admit I'd not want an architect building my home who was self trained and had no formal training, in the case of teaching English in China, it sure isn't hurting anything. Let's be honest, the Chinese education system is junk, and the goal isn't really to teach English anyway, only to make people think they are learning, whilst being entertained. The sooner people accept this reality, the sooner they will stop all this yes, snobbish talk, at least in this regard. I never said a degree is useless, it is however superfluous in regards to teaching English here in China, for the most part anyhow.

It also doesn't guarantee teaching ability of any kind, a far more important skill, and one that can't easily be taught, or learned. What good is knowledge if you can't pass it on?

People too often miss all of these points and simply focus upon education, and without even questioning the quality of either the education, or the person who received it.

I think a lot of different factors contribute to a good teacher. Having decent knowledge of the subject is useful of course. Far more important however is the ability to explain yourself, articulate, in a way that the student can understand. Most people don't have a natural talent for this, though many can learn to one degree or another. If you have a real talent for teaching though, and decent knowledge of the subject, no, a degree is not needed, unless you are looking to become a doctor, lawyer, or molecular biologist.

Just my two cents on the subject, I'm sure others will chime in.

I disagree. A degree by no means is any indication that someone can "learn new skils". I must agree with what the Reconciled poster said, a degree is useless in China for teaching oral English or any type of English, unless it is a BA in English, then that degree holder might have some merit to be a decent teacher in the future. Even an education degree or a degree in English will not automatically make someone a good teacher.

I think I have learned how to be a good teacher at university, but it had nothing to do with my degree ( which is a degree that is useless for teaching English ) As for "skirtchasers" and drunks, well, what is wrong with that? You come across as being a bit of a wowser to me! So you expect a Western man to come to China for a year ( or much longer ) and remain celibate? That is unrealistic, unnatural and quite stupid. I don't drink that much anymore, but if a teacher wants to go and get drunk on Friday nights then could for him/her.

There is one rule for the Chinese and another rule for laowei it seems. The Chinese go out and get as drunk as they want, but an FT should show restraint? Why? Chinese men can cheat on the wives and spend time with prostitutes, but foreigners should not? There are also some Western men whose primary purpose to be in China is to find a wife, that is a very good thing, and it should be encouraged, not frowned upon.

In regard to fake degrees I also agree with Reconciled. Education here is crap, it always will be, importing a bunch of ivory tower Western academics to teach here will not make any difference. Many Chinese people have fake degrees, along with quite a few FT's. I am sure that many of these people are actually quite competent, as they have learned their skills through practical experience, unlike stuck up ivory tower Western academic snobs!

As some one with a degree in history and not English, I have come to be able to teach English in China by self-improvement and study. A degree in something, tells or should tell an employer that you can learn new skills. Besides, if you have a degree you should have taken English 101 and a few other courses that taught you the difference between and noun and a verb, or I would think. You can take it from there to be a better teacher. Besides if China is the educational black hole of the world, let us not continue this self-perpetuating joke of non-teachers and backpackers coming from the West. It took me a few months to convince my present school that 1) I was not a skirtchaser 2) I was not a pedophile 3)That I actually see myself as a teacher first and not the foreign town drunk (they have one already). They are having me do trainings for their primary school English teachers now.
As the world economy, not just the Western economies come down further, I hope the Chinese have the sense (a big hope here) to choose better teachers from a bigger pool of qualified and knowledgeable teachers.