I agree with you totally about china becoming a place that is less desirable to live in general due to the xenophobia, politics, and lack of decent jobs. You really have to put on the blinders to work there and pretend everything is okay, but you may end up leaving the country with a warped sense of intuition and a damaged conscious to boot. The expats who live there seem to get dumber every day as well. We have seen the likes of folks like [edited] and their ability to discern what moral is and isn't. Those who want to go there and work the long haul might want to use the aformentioned folks as an example on the level of character of people whom you'll be dealing with.

If i may reply again?

'm not going to get political here in China,

Fair enough, but that just proves my point surely. Anyway, think I'll leave it there, tightly wound enough as it is...

and teaching illegally isn't the crime of the century. Honestly, I have no fear about a knock at the door from the authorities. That's just me.

Fair enough, as I said, just not for me, nowt personal.

In fact, breaking visa regulations is small beer here compared to what it would be in Blighty.

There is still a fine, it's better not to risk the hassle, again just me.

As for many people in the UK not envying me living here in China, so what? Who cares?

Not saying a proverbial "who", just many would prefer to enjoy the freedoms in the UK, as opposed to the lack of those freedoms in China, free press, free internet amongst two that I would personally never give up, you just can't have those in China, you pushed my buttons on this point, you got my answer.

I don't give a damn about your warnings.

I didn't threaten or warn you nor use foul language at any point, but ok.

I'll continue to go my own way here - end of story!

OK, again, your right to do that, I'm just disagreeing with you about it, without an exclaimation mark, perhaps the boozing and smoking is getting to you, hope not, you seem a nice bloke, just a difference of opinion, thats all. I still maintain working legally in ANY country is sensible, not foolish.

I will look at your link, but won't promise I will listen to it. I still maintain that the UK and other commonwealth realms are far freer than China ever will be.

And Blighty has the most street cameras/head of population in the world.

Agreed. I have read that before.

Observers are saying it has become a police state.

Can you wear a I hate the president t shirt there? Again, not personal, sorry for including that, just riled me somewhat.

If you don't listen to the link, you'll not know why.

Exercising the freedom not to listen perhaps, for all those in china who would need a vpn to listen!

Peace and good luck in finding gainful employment!

Thanks, and light...
SMGS

Hi, I will address your post now, if i may?

Because the employer has employed an FT illegally.

Two wrongs don't make a right. The employer and the FT are both culpable then, imho.

If he issues a release letter, the letter will prove the illegal employment.

Which could have been avoided if they had done things legally, right?

It'll be interesting to see what transpires in Yuncheng, if anything.

Indeed, keep me posted. I don't expect much to change, but who knows?

I'm not teaching now, so it won't affect me.

Fair enough.

I forgot to mention that some FTs in Yuncheng have Shanghai residence permits, which is also illegal.

Yes, I'd agree it's illegal, but I'd rather have a residence permit even from there, than not. If push came to shove, who would get kicked out first?

I'm not going to answer your other questions on this public board

Fair enough, but it still doesn't mean working on a Z visa legally is wrong. Many countries, like Taiwan, and yes, it is a country, insist on foreigners obeying the law.

, but I agree with you that it's risky to teach illegally.

Agreed. Ignorance of the law is no excuse.

Unlike you, I can sleep well while doing so. We are all different.

Maybe you can, maybe you can't, at a personal level I just hope the knock on the door never happens for you, it's not pleasant. China do not issue retirement visas, do they not? Do you have the green card? I'd hold your fingers over the keys until you are actually a resident in some form.

But then again, I have the money to pay for new passports and to pay fines.

On that no problem, it's your money. I still maintain it is a ballache.

As for HK, it's a concrete jungle that I have no interest whatsoever in visiting.

Some people might say thinner mongolia is a freezing, primitive hellhole. Personally, I thought thinner mongolia not too bad, especially in summer. Great food up there, the best I ate in China.

As I said, we are all different.

True, vive la difference.

Good luck in your job search.

Thanks, the cogs are still turning, support appreciated and respected.

I do not envy you living in the UK.

Seems many in the UK, also do not envy you living in China?

Free speech there is being severely compromised.

Did you read my bit about HK? China has nowhere near the amount of free speech that HK,or the UK has. Right to assemble? No chance, the police would just make a bloodbath,,,,,

I will look at your link, but won't promise I will listen to it. I still maintain that the UK and other commonwealth realms are far freer than China ever will be.

Peace and light,
SMGS

Going through passports faster than the average is nothing compared to advantages such as avoiding medicals and visa runs to HK/UB.

Given the new costs for UK passports overseas, I hope that those words don't come back to bite you. Who knows as you are retired and wealthy, I presume, maybe the cash is not a concern, but at the ballache level alone, it is a nightmare. Why are you so concerned about avoiding medicals? Just curious? And HK isn't all that bad as a break from the mainland, a free press, internet without a vpn, good beer and food....owch! Nothing personal, just wondering why you are so staunchly steadfast on these issues?

As for release letters, they don't apply.

Why?

I reckon there are at least 30 foreigners teaching on behalf of the three Yuncheng agents on L or X or F visas.

Regardless of what you say, the authorities can still boot them out. It has happened before when they decide to do things on a whim...

The local PSB turn a blind eye. If they dare to take action against foreign teachers teaching illegally, they will be fired by the mayor.

The mayor is still Chinese right? Yeah, I know China is different from a western country, and the rural areas differ from Shanghai, but it's not like FT's are investors bringing in millions in hard currency. They have in the past, and can in the present, take action.

I guess the mayor and the PSB get regular bungs from the three local agents.

Quite possible, however, I still wouldn't chance it. I'd rather sleep at night, without sweating a knock on the door and a trip down to the psb....

Just me though...again, not personal.

I need an employer who lets me teach without a medical and without a Z visa

I know it is touchy one, but you must burn through passports like mad. Unless a spousal L visa is any different?