I don't think it should be that drastic, Mancunian. Maybe your own extreme ways of thinking causes problems for yourself. It really all depends on how you frame things. For example it is beyond me how you could have seen an antagonistic factor in my comment about teachers standing together on issues. When you were posting as "Tom" and "Apollyon" some of your comments may have suggested someone who doesn't deserve the label of grovelling weasel. I do know that there are many new teachers coming into the ESL field every day, and many of them will be duped into working for less than desirable employers. I also do know that even if 99.99% of good people would not work at TC in the long term I know that there is always the .01% who may not have many choices, and I do know at least one. You don't have to invite the argument from others onto yourself, it really is up to your own choice. It is the comments that you have made towards others who have posted about their bad working experiences that really bother me. I have been through similar situations (plural), and I know for a fact that seeing the comments you made towards some posters would make me think very low of you if I was in their shoes. You don't necessarily deserve this though, maybe look at how you see things and change your views on how others see things and you can realize that all of this really doesn't pose any threats to you. All statements made in this post done out of good will.

But scrupulous ESL forums filter out adverse posts about ESL employers who pay advertising fees to said forums. I, for one, am disinterested in reading censored ESL forums; I won't allow myself to be conned by one-sided media.
The only way our industry will be a better place is if ESL employers, by and large, were to take the lead by behaving honestly and paying worthwhile salaries. If they do so, they'll be able to fill many more of their vacancies with professional teachers rather than with irresponsible malingerers! Then the number of unfair complaints on less scrupulous ESL forums will be much reduced.

Forums-even ones which try and be fair and just have to stay afloat financially. It's a bitter pill to swallow but maybe it's the advertisers who butter the turnips; although, just conjecture on my part, because I have no idea how forums pay their bills and make a few bob- they would be waiting a long time to turn a shilling out of the likes of myself. Fraid grey areas have to exist.

Another option might be, require people to post under their real name. Boy, oh, boy – if this happened, the less scrupulous ESL forums would fold over night – and our industry would be a better place.

But scrupulous ESL forums filter out adverse posts about ESL employers who pay advertising fees to said forums. I, for one, am disinterested in reading censored ESL forums; I won't allow myself to be conned by one-sided media.
The only way our industry will be a better place is if ESL employers, by and large, were to take the lead by behaving honestly and paying worthwhile salaries. If they do so, they'll be able to fill many more of their vacancies with professional teachers rather than with irresponsible malingerers! Then the number of unfair complaints on less scrupulous ESL forums will be much reduced.

Sure, there’s occasionally something undesirable malingering at the bottom of a swimming pool, but precisely who was the responsible (or irresponsible) party, isn’t always apparent. History is littered with examples of the guilty person being the one who ran around shouting the loudest and pointing their finger with contrived contempt at others. You don’t have to look any further than what’s happening right now on the Korean Peninsula.

The truth of the matter is, many ESL teachers with an ‘axe to grind’ head straight to the internet and ‘anonymously’ post all kinds of rubbish about schools where they used work, comforted by the knowledge that their targets have absolutely no recourse.

I know exactly who is responsible for popping that undesirable malingerer into greedy school owners' swimming pools, and I'm going to spill the beans- it's Dr Turnoi; he relishes adding one of his crocodiles to the water to stir things up a bit, hahaha.

I agree, there is a lot of rubbish posted by disgruntled good-for-nothing FT's, but it is totally untrue that there's no recourse for the hard done by school- you and your longest post of the month is living proof of that....however, you may have been wiser to keep quiet, at the risk of opening a right can of worms- am I right or am I right?

It seems to me that many of the ‘forums’ attached to English as a Second Language (ESL) websites have become the playground for people who purport to be teachers, but exhibit behavior more in-line with what you’d expect from your average, ‘garden variety’, school-yard bully.

Visit almost any ESL ‘forum’ world-wide and you’ll see an array of vitriol from so-called teachers directed at ESL schools and people who work at ESL schools. Those who occupy the unenviable position of Director of Studies are common targets, although school owners – who are often named - cop a lot abuse. In stark contrast, I’ve been unable to locate a single post on an ESL ‘forum’ anywhere in the world, attacking an ESL teacher.

If you believe what you read on ESL ‘forums’, ESL schools are purely profit driven and those who own them are the pit of humanity, have little regard for students and even less regard for teachers. Think about it for a minute. It just doesn’t make sense. Students and teachers are what make a school tick. School owners have a vested interest in keeping their students sufficiently motivated to continue building their English language skills and holding on to good teachers - and from my own experience - most schools conduct their affairs accordingly.

Sure, there’s occasionally something undesirable malingering at the bottom of a swimming pool, but precisely who was the responsible (or irresponsible) party, isn’t always apparent. History is littered with examples of the guilty person being the one who ran around shouting the loudest and pointing their finger with contrived contempt at others. You don’t have to look any further than what’s happening right now on the Korean Peninsula.

The truth of the matter is, many ESL teachers with an ‘axe to grind’ head straight to the internet and ‘anonymously’ post all kinds of rubbish about schools where they used work, comforted by the knowledge that their targets have absolutely no recourse.

Let’s look at a hypothetical situation. You own an English language school in the beautiful city of Can Tho, located in Vietnam’s Mekong Delta region. You dismiss a Canadian ESL ‘teacher’ because you find out they have bogus qualifications. The next day your name is all over the internet. You’re portrayed as the employer from hell. What can you do? Nothing! If you choose to defend your good name, you simply add fuel to fire and 100 negative reviews becomes 200, although you know - and people who know you know - you’re too generous for your own good. With a rush of blood to the head you might come out with something like – I’m going to report the offender to the police - or perhaps - I’ll see them in court! Yeah, right! Then it dawns on you, they posted anonymously and no doubt have long since departed the dodgy internet café where they did the deed. Most likely, you wouldn’t have the resources to track them down anyway.

I understand the ‘freedom of speech’ line that’s often rolled out to support the kind of characters that I’m drawing attention to in this article. Any ESL teacher worth a grain of salt, however, understands that freedom of speech entails a range of responsibilities. In a civil society you can’t have one without the other. Anonymously attacking institutions and people on the internet has nothing to do with freedom of speech - and has no place in a civil society.

It seems to me that it would be really easy to resolve this issue, through any number of means. Perhaps the people who run the ESL ‘forums’ can be more mindful that those who are under attack have mothers, fathers, husbands, wives, children and so forth - scrutinise what appears on their site and remove what’s simply personal abuse. Another option might be, require people to post under their real name. Boy, oh, boy – if this happened, the less scrupulous ESL forums would fold over night – and our industry would be a better place.

Getting back to the original question - ESL forums, should they be taken seriously? I think the answer is, it depends on how seriously you’re prepared to believe comments from anonymous people who live in cyberspace. Personally, if I want to know something, I’m sufficiently confident to make my own enquiries.

About the author - Peter Goudge is the Managing Director of the Australia-Vietnam School of English (AVSE) located in Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam.