Re: sad...Crossing my fingers.

Ahhhh ... don't I know it's difficult to locate TOTALLY qualified teachers. Believe it or not, on occasion, it's the same here in the USA! And whenever a 'godsend' arrives on the scene, from day one, the employer is worried about HOW LONG he/she will remain. Especially in the private school marketplace, one can expect quite a bit of 'instructor roaming.' I think the sole exception might be us old codgers who, unlike our younger counterpart, tend to have less of the gypsy running in our veins. For MY part, I can say that after 7+ hours of teaching TOEFL each day, I'M GOOD AND TIRED!

By not conducting a thorough check of a teacher's credentials before offering employment, the employer is taking one hell of a risk. And then we have the agencies -- many of which have been proven to be dishonest, by seemingly recruiting ANYTHING that walks and possesses a passport from an English-speaking country! One day, some bright boy will have to devise an effective, yet inexpensive, solution to this dilemma. In the interim, at best, the question of recruitment seems like one gigantic crap shoot. A disgusting reality ...
n'est-e pas, mon chr?

VIVA ESL!

Re: sad...Crossing my fingers.

YES, dee ... I fear that what you've said regarding 'intimidation' is quite true. Stiff warnings tend to scare away many of the legitimate players in The Great Game of EFL. Yet, logic would dictate than ANY worthwhile entity in this world is subject to abuse at the hands of a dispassionate minority. After all, this is part of human nature, the perennial struggle of good vs. evil, both of which quantities are at the human option from the get-go. This all boils down to the fact that having chosen to be a teacher is not written in the stars, but is a decision not to be taken too lightly. Nonetheless, we are still dealing with human beings who, irrespective of their fancy titles and good (declared) intentions, can still be the misfits of a society. I fear that weeding out this unsavory element DOES run the risk of weakening the interests of those who are truly qualified, yet, TRUE qualification consists of not only academic facility, but also an understanding of the human element and the necessity for warnings against counterproductive behavior. Maybe that's what is better referred to as 'maturity.'

Finally, a whiner can surely be one gigantic pain in the gluteus maximus, and should be gotten rid of a.s.a.p. The playboy/girl, however, is quite another problem. So long as he/she doesn't demonstrate his/her tendencies in public, AND DOESN'T VICTIMIZE STUDENTS OR STAFF, what the hell CAN you do? We are all entitled to a private life, just so long as it doesn't interfere with the progress of others, as well as injure the reputation of one's employer.

Let me hear your opinions, Dee, and thanks for your reply.

The Arrogant One

> I hope the result you mentioned will actually happen here. China
> really needs people who want to be teachers. No room for the whiners
> and playboys/playgirls.

> Here's hoping it happens!!

> Im just curious though, if you think being more direct and exact in
> contracts will scare away new teachers wnating to come here. When I
> first saw the stuff that is in some of the contracts during my job
> search, it was intimidating. I felt a bit like they don't trust me at
> all, so does that mean they also can't be trusted. My school has had
> to put stupid details like that in contracts, but as a friend said to
> me, that just makes the good teachers feel uncomfortable, when they
> arent the ones who cause problems. The whiner & playboy that we
> have had, both totally disregarded everything in the contract. The
> whiner kept whining til we said good bye...and the playboy kept doing
> whatever it was he did behind closed doors. Sadly.

> I agree with all of your points mentioned. I hope it doesn't sound
> like Im trying to argue. Just wondering if you can give me some
> insight on this side of it.

> Thanks & looking forward to hearing more.

sad...Crossing my fingers.

I hope the result you mentioned will actually happen here. China really needs people who want to be teachers. No room for the whiners and playboys/playgirls.

Here's hoping it happens!!

Im just curious though, if you think being more direct and exact in contracts will scare away new teachers wnating to come here. When I first saw the stuff that is in some of the contracts during my job search, it was intimidating. I felt a bit like they don't trust me at all, so does that mean they also can't be trusted. My school has had to put stupid details like that in contracts, but as a friend said to me, that just makes the good teachers feel uncomfortable, when they arent the ones who cause problems. The whiner & playboy that we have had, both totally disregarded everything in the contract. The whiner kept whining til we said good bye...and the playboy kept doing whatever it was he did behind closed doors. Sadly.

I agree with all of your points mentioned. I hope it doesn't sound like Im trying to argue. Just wondering if you can give me some insight on this side of it.

Thanks & looking forward to hearing more.

> ==================================

> Idi, Man --

> Of course, with ANY open forum, you are bound to encounter the good,
> the bad, and the ugly of society ... in this case foreign society.
> But, while you are busy critiquing societal differences, you must
> bear in mind that living and working overseas -- in most cases for
> the very first time -- one's reactions are usually dictated by
> factors of upbringing, experience, and the acceptance-rejection
> mechanism as experienced (utilized) in his/her own country. To make a
> long story mercifully short, my friend, you must give a little extra
> leeway to your western visitor ... NOT that he/she is a privileged
> character, but because that person's social background requires just
> a tad more attention (if not consideration) if all is to function
> well. Now, once all due care has been sincerely rendered, and the
> individual still turns out to be a whining, counter-productive,
> non-respectful brat, then it's time to deal with the situation in
> another, not-so-courteous manner.. PROVIDED THERE HAS BEEN ADVANCED
> WARNING THAT SEVERE CONSEQUENCES WILL ENSUE (including, perhaps,
> forfeiture of travel reimbursement) AS A RESULT OF SUCH BEHAVIOR. It
> should rightfully be the job of the agency or school to present this
> to any and all candidates, FOR ACKNOWLEDGMENT IN WRITING, before job
> offers are made and contracts are signed. RESULT (hopefully): Fewer
> whiners and playboys, and a better feeling of cooperation on the part
> of Orientals toward their "foreign specialists."

> Just a thought.

Re: Sad

> Looking at all of these posts. I felt like a Judge trying to decipher
> what was true and what was exaggerated. I'm a teacher (Seoul, korea).
> In my honest opinion: The problem with all this is that teachers I
> talk to complains about the same thing, they think they're smarter
> than their director/boss and can fool people. I think they're wrong.
> Bullies make life miserable for everyone, including themselves. I
> personally have never had a problem with any korean employer. I agree
> with, good jobs/bad jobs everywhere. I sincerely hope this changes in
> the future and only happy teachers remain in their jobs.

> Idi
> Happy to be here!

Excuse me for asking Idi. Your family name wouldn't happen to be Ot by any chance? That would explain a lot.

It's not the size of the dog in the fight but the size of the fight in the dog.

Re: Sad

> It's just kind of sad when nonprofessional teachers get to complaint
> all day and get internet forum's attention when the good ones just
> get ignored because it's assumed that they are all the same. A bad
> attitude make losers breed more losers. Try replacing a loser
> attitude with a winner attitude and see what happens. Or are you
> scare of winning?

============

WOW! Don't you characters EVER get sick of spieling out the same shtick day after day ... year after year ... when, in fact, much of it has been proven anachronistic, hardly befitting an entirely new generation of thinkers AND DOERS? Albeit there are many who use this board merely to whine and exhibit their ignorance, you should at least TRY to give some credit to those of us 'foreign devils' who have SOMETHING USEFUL to say, even if it is in the form of a critique. My God! (excuse the expression!) Is there no open-mindedness to be found anywhere???

Peace.

Sad

It's just kind of sad when nonprofessional teachers get to complaint all day and get internet forum's attention when the good ones just get ignored because it's assumed that they are all the same. A bad attitude make losers breed more losers. Try replacing a loser attitude with a winner attitude and see what happens. Or are you scare of winning?