cunning, i am a bit surprised that turnoi's got some rather different experiences from me, although i agree with you. china's a huge country and with a humongous population. how could it all be the same?

Your experience may perhaps be a single experience limited to certain schools
at a certain location. According to my experience, your experience does not
apply generally to all places and students in China. Hence, we should be
careful to overgeneralise.

well, you may be right if you consider fujian, guangdong, guanxi and chongqing to "a certain location". moreover, i'd second you, if all the "places" and "students" that i have met are that "single experience" of mine. i hope i am not going to be too confrontational on here, but i've got to say that i've worked at a primary school for first half a year on mainland and then with a private mill and in the academic management position where we've dealt with all age groups and types of schools as well as kinds of students. then, having worked with high school kids wishing for abroad studies, i've only confirmed my view on this topic. THE CHINESE STUDENTS ARE "PROGRAMMED"!

cheers and beers to our views and experiences on mainland

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it takes an effort to teach, but then it takes a bloody effort to "unteach" :)