Oh, it's you. Do you use half the aliases on the site! I have nothing to say
to you.

WRONG again...I only use the beer aliases. No idea who edited or leaping are, ta gracias...

And I know I still irk you, don't I Tom lad...:)

I see you use this much-loved by the Chinese word 'cooperate' You are obviously not a native born English speaker. Why would anybody want to co-operate with a private school in China that want you to work for a lower hourly rate of pay than you'd get at a university, with no chance of promotion, no pension, no sick pay, no holiday pay and the company is invariably owned by a non English speaking ex chicken farmer with sod all interest in the English language himself. The only industrious westerners in China are engineers and such like whose companies are investing in China, not white monkeys who will never be allowed a decent cut of the education industry pie, no matter how much they co-operate.

I repeat, FT's in the main are not proper teachers, they are not recognised as such in their respective countries and they can be industrious and co-operative as they like in those countries but we wouldn't be able to even get a job in said schools wiping the students arses.

An FT's job in China should be a long working holiday-we shouldn't be ingratiating ourselves to ex-chicken farmer Chinese gravy train private school owners.

You can be industrious and co-operative till the cows come home but there will never be any advancment for you as a FT in China, and of course back home it'll count for nothing.

Now, I'll tell you what would be really industrious- Get a job in a university, as few hours as possible. learn to speak and read fluent Mandarin instead of getting poe-faces every night. If you want extra money, put your details on a Chinese website and go ziji shang ke- Illegal yes, but are you a man or a mouse? A private training centre drunken waster mouse?

You took the time to type all that and respond to my posting and keep confusing me with someone else. Fine. That is your right. But it is also my right to dissect your post to pieces and respond as I may...or is that only the right of you PHd toff types who look down on others from their ivory towers? And by your own admission you were a toilet cleaner in the UK, so you can't claim to know everything regarding teaching-and neither can I, nor do I claim to! In fact, I have about as much interesting in teaching as watching paint dry, hope that pretty much sums up my whole attitude to this TEFL lark, anyways, onwards and upwards....

Co-operate is an English word, and used in the West. You disagree and seem to think I am Chinese, but you do know me, both in person and on these boards. You would probably think I'm a Uzbek as long as I don't agree with you on what constitutes Chinglish, and what I know to be a real English word.

You wrote: You can be industrious and co-operative till the cows come home but there will never be any advancment for you as a FT in China

Depends on how you view it. To a glass half empty type of person they will always see the worst? But for someone with a bit of get up and go, an FT can provide a springboard/starting point into something better in China, if one remains positive and works hard. I don't see how this irks you so much, that others earn more, or work more hours...does that affect your hours that you work or your life?! Live your own life, enjoy your easy job...that's what I did and would do if I went back, leave the hard slog to those that want it...

Last but not least: Get a job in a university, as few hours as possible. learn to speak and read fluent Mandarin instead of getting poe-faces every night. If you want extra money, put your details on a Chinese website and go ziji shang ke- Illegal yes, but are you a man or a mouse? A private training centre drunken waster mouse?

I agree with all this except the ad hominem insult at the end. I did work 10 hours at a college in China...and it was like watching paint dry, boring second tier city, racist locals (yokels), and to fu coming out of my ears...fugged about it! I learnt to speak ( but not read) Mandarin well, and even some Cantonese...although I am guilty of getting poe faces (smashed? drunk?) every night, although not any more, my present employer in this country wouldn't tolerate those kind of antics...A man last time I looked, although I've been told I do have some characteristics of a mouse, all except loyalty Tommy boy...never worked at a private training centre in my life, I work at a PUBLIC college now, but I do teach 18 hours, but do get paid accordingly...

I'll await your responses for round 2.

Good day, your old pal from Central China.
A.

Nothing in this world is perfect nor black and white. You have to take the good with the bad and accept the shades of gray. You have to decide what you are willing to tolerate and what to eliminate. It's

It's centre not center, unless you are an American of course. I should stop flying off the handle and read what i say. I have a small key board and often shove in an extra letter or miss one out. The odd spelling error upsets me not, I was merely noticing you must be an American since the rest of the English speaking world including Canadians spell centre like that. Also grey as opposed to gray. Don't worry i know one is English English and the other oxymoron American English. Both okay so don't go into one of your fits.

Now, Dear Boy, it was you who informed all us perverts sitting in our brother-in-laws' cellars leering at naked Chinese girls on the internet, that Web was not only a bad employer but also a lying one when it comes to students and presumably their parents who fork out the cash. Now your descriptions of bad liars do not fit happily into the shades of grey, do they? Nobody elses fault but your own that we are all homing in once again on this terrible outfit. I can't imagine that Web are too amused at you rubbing extra salt into their wounds.

One teacher I knew thought 15 hours a week too much! Some people don't want to be co-operative and industrious it seems...real losers back in their respective homelands

I see you use this much-loved by the Chinese word 'cooperate' You are obviously not a native born English speaker. Why would anybody want to co-operate with a private school in China that want you to work for a lower hourly rate of pay than you'd get at a university, with no chance of promotion, no pension, no sick pay, no holiday pay and the company is invariably owned by a non English speaking ex chicken farmer with sod all interest in the English language himself. The only industrious westerners in China are engineers and such like whose companies are investing in China, not white monkeys who will never be allowed a decent cut of the education industry pie, no matter how much they co-operate.

I repeat, FT's in the main are not proper teachers, they are not recognised as such in their respective countries and they can be industrious and co-operative as they like in those countries but we wouldn't be able to even get a job in said schools wiping the students arses.

An FT's job in China should be a long working holiday-we shouldn't be ingratiating ourselves to ex-chicken farmer Chinese gravy train private school owners.

You can be industrious and co-operative till the cows come home but there will never be any advancment for you as a FT in China, and of course back home it'll count for nothing.

Now, I'll tell you what would be really industrious- Get a job in a university, as few hours as possible. learn to speak and read fluent Mandarin instead of getting poe-faces every night. If you want extra money, put your details on a Chinese website and go ziji shang ke- Illegal yes, but are you a man or a mouse? A private training centre drunken waster mouse?

An FT in China should not be working 30-40 hours a week for a measily 10,000 RMB, when 5000 RMB for 15 hours a week in a university, holidays paid for , your flat, internet (desktop supplied) paid for, will give you a better hourly rate of pay, and you stand a much better chance of leaving China without a bad taste in your mouth.

One teacher I knew thought 15 hours a week too much! Some people don't want to be co-operative and industrious it seems...real losers back in their respective homelands!

: From what you say, Web seems to have all the ingredients of a money-grabbing training centre

: The villains that
: attacked you and your wife, raped your wife and murdered her; however, those that
: attacked me and my wife only raped her and spared spared her life; therefore, I highly
: recommend that particular area for your vacation this year, makes as much sense.

: Your logic is a bit lacking,

In other words, you don't know anything about Web but are perfectly willing to express an opinion about it. If you read my original post, I stated that Web, like all private centers (and universities), has problems. Yet, despite it's problems, the students (at the center where I worked) learned English. Many of them were quite happy with the instruction they received. You can't please everyone.

Ha ha! You compare a company, whose sales people are sometimes dishonest, to rapists and murderers. Then suggest MY logic is lacking! Your sense of proportion is what is lacking.

Can you tell me why it appears that certain posters make an inordinate number of contributions on this board? It doesn't matter which thread, nor the topic; the same posters denigrate everyone and everything, complete with stupid crocodile references. Is it possible "crocodile" is a euphemism for "Levi lizard", and that poster is flying solo with his reptilian companion every night? I'd rather spend my evening with a beautiful Chinese girl than a crocodile.

These posters have an extraordinary amount of time to scan this site looking for new posts to attack. My own theory is that without the requisite social skills, personal grooming habits, or attractiveness, it's impossible for them to engage in the standard pursuits of drinking in bars and chasing (and catching) beautiful Chinese girls. Maybe they're actually still in the UK, living in their brother-in-law's basement, vicariously (but jealously) experiencing China through those of us making friends, seeing the sights, and enjoying ourselves in this amazing country.

You've posted a lot on this site, so you're obviously an expert in all things ESL. What's your opinion about these people?

I'd post a longer response, but I've got to meet with some local hotties right now. If the goons play nice, perhaps I'll put up some photos for them to salivate over.

Web is a joke. Get real. Their so-called corporate trainer was a kid from the U.K. that walked around all day long impressing himself with words such as befuddlement. Their HDQRS is a joke in a B grade building with office and class space spread over 2 floors in a nasty looking building. The FT's there, most of them, look like drunk backpackers. Their VP for the company named Sunny as I recall was some uptight witch without a clue but undoubtedly she knew how to smoke the baloney pony otherwise she could never have been in such a position. Their lessons are rubbish and for a long time they were circulating a lesson from center to center that had a plan for teaching students about what an acronym was. The lesson was in circulation for some 9-years and the example they used was the word thumbs. They had the word mixed up and the lesson plan stated that an acronym was a mixed up word. Below that were some boxes to place the jumbled word into proper order. When I saw that I nearly fell over. I'll never forget it. Center directors are idiots with money to invest in a local Web franchisee and they, much like their teachers, have no clue. Don't even think about Web and the same is true for Wall Street or EF for that matter. They are all rubbish.

Bottom line is this, training centers exist to make money. They will squeeze everything they can out of you to make a little bit more money. When you burn out, you are easily replaceable. But, Web is one of the better places to work because you are actually TEACHING, unlike most schools where you just make conversation to entertain the students

Yes, well, my main consideration is not how good it is for the students, it's how they'd treat me if I came half way around the globe to work for them. Can you elaborate please, what do you mean by "you are actually TEACHING, unlike most schools where you just make conversation to entertain the students?" because some would say that it's actually the job of the oral English FT to make conversation. Most students are actually pleased only if you give them sweets, play Mr Bean, and allow the little [edited] to make as much noise as their hearts content. To please them with conversation doesn't seem that bad to me. Remember FT's are generally not proper teachers and are generally employed to teach oral and converse, and not to discuss Shakespeare and anguish over his grammar. Real English teaching requires great emphasis on grammar, you can't get away from it.

Hi guys

I was just wondering if anyone has experience working for Web International in Shanghai. I saw a thread on Suzhou, but the messages are a bit old. Please let me know if the place is a legit and reasonably good employer.

Thanks!