Non-crazy
- 2011-07-06
True.
I dont see the utility of calling people names when you dont know them, slagging off schools you've never visited. . . The only effect is to rile and insult the good people and I assume the people making a bad name for English and foreigners would be indifferent, and newcomers may be unnecessarily anxious. I think it is sensibleto say that one should always have a back up plan when jumping in the deep end. Having some spare cash for instance, not already being heavily in debt in a more valuable currency.
Can we instead agree that there are some great people, some complete knobs, some schools that are good and some that are bad. Some that are on the up and some that exploit with very little interest in quality teaching - at all, ever. Moreover, can we agree that that this is the case, regardless of qualification, geographic location, but with some important peculiarities in China where people are offered "opportunities" that they dont have back home. I think I have been very lucky, it sounds like there are some bad places.
I've made my decision of school now and am very happy with just about everything, so long as I dont convert the salary into my dollars. Luckily I was able to visit China on holiday so I could see things for myself.
If any newcomers want some advice, let me know. I have found some good things already and have some pretty sound inside info from my contacts in China too.
Kevin
- 2011-07-05
Posting on this site does hopefully help people that have no experience or idea what is happening in the world of ESL. I would hope that these post would never be censored as they do have a function to perform. There are alot of bitter folks out there with axes to grind and their words are just as helpful as those that have had good experiences. Sometimes the message gets lost in the translation though and I think it is the responsibility of the reader to sift through the rubbish and converse with those that seem rational and willing to discuss things in a mature manner.
I have been insulted here often and i will admit done my fair share as well but ultimately the goal is to tear down the curtain and secrecy and try not to let others be exploited. If even one person is helped then this site has done its job.
There are those that come to china for the cheap beer and woman, those that come for the experience and those that come to teach because they enjoy the job. Although these groups have different agendas and some might think that the other is a fool for thinking what they do it does not have to mean that one group cannot participate.
foxy
- 2011-07-04
I know what you're saying, but I suspect it will fall upon deaf ears in the case of almost all of the instigators of rude posts. I think having an ongoing debate with them regarding mutual differences of opinion is very unlikely to be productive, and that's probably what the mischief-makers among them are hoping will happen.
I believe more latitude as regards board censorship is bound to ratchet up personal abuse whenever controversial topics appear. From personal experience, I can say that posting that a recruiter is just so-so when others have rubbished him is more than enough to get abuse in return.
You can ask the board to delete a particular post if you feel it insults you. I suppose whether somebody does so depends on his/her tolerance level. Personally, I'd never do that. But I can appreciate that everyone is different.
All the same, this board has posts that impart very useful information that cannot be found on other forums. I suspect that increased board censorship would diminish the number of posts of that sort. So, I'm content to see the board run the way it is at present.
Non-crazy
- 2011-07-04
There are ways of expressing things.
If someone wants to be harshly critical, then so be it. There are ways of doing that that might actually assist people and other ways that assist nobody and just insult people... Some very good people. I admit I havent made a comprehensive review of people's contributions but, after the first impressions, why would I bother?
Im not suggesting censorship, except maybe self-censorship. I know people get excited when they think they have posted something cutting and probably enjoy the reactions they get but doesn't that get a bit old after a while?
It seems like there is plenty of room for criticism of the sector and I agree with much of the sentiment. That said, broad, deliberately insulting and inflammatory comments arent that useful... Except perhaps to entertain the poster in some strange way.
Barking and flapping ones arms, shouting at passers-by, if done on the street, pretty much makes you look a bit of a loon and you could say the most wise and important thing ever but nobody will listen. I've tried.
Dont bother trying to get an emotional reaction either, It won't happen. If, however, someone wants to take the time to properly list and explain some things that newcomers need to know, then that would be interesting.
foxy
- 2011-07-03
I really cant see how a site like this can be useful when people just go off half-cocked. It is akin to a youtube comment section, or even a Justin Bieber fansite or something, excepting a few rare comments that are actually well considered. Unfortunately, you have to scroll down past a whole bunch of irrelevancy and idiocy to find them.
Can't access u tube from here, and never heard of justin bieber. Judging by most of what you post, I'm not missing that either. You have contributed nothing constructive. Fact is, you've focussed on slagging off posters who are anti training centre and anti private school. But you conveniently omitted to say that those same posters post about all aspects of EFL in China, not just about schools outwith the public sector. Then you have the nerve to say that you wouldn't want your children to be taught by such posters. No chance of any of them doing so, I reckon, as they'd never teach at a private school in any case. They wouldn't want to teach your children, anyways, judging by the attitude you have displayed in public!
I guess you'd be better off sticking to middle-of-the-road, pretend-everything-in-the-garden-is-rosy boards that major in smalltalk like 'the saloon' and 'the greasy spoon', with mods who edit out meaty posts to protect their advertisers, and ban posters who are deemed offenders of touchy readers like you. Reading what's posted on them is a case of wading through heaps of trivial tripe to find the odd crumb of useful info while coming across many nasty old posters wth big egos trying to play oneupmanship in public. Pathetic actually, a smorga's board, no way - a snobs' board whose posters bicker about inconsequential stuff, and stick the knife in whenever they can.
Keep up the good stuff, Turnoi. Don't change on account of the odd wingeing from self-serving grovellers.
Non-crazy
- 2011-07-02
I really cant see how a site like this can be useful when people just go off half-cocked. It is akin to a youtube comment section, or even a Justin Bieber fansite or something, excepting a few rare comments that are actually well considered. Unfortunately, you have to scroll down past a whole bunch of irrelevancy and idiocy to find them.
Frankly, there is little way to tell how good any of the teachers on here are, and the only way to judge a school is to visit or to make judgements yourself in a similar way to which you would weigh any job opportunity, albeit from a distance. To be paranoid and fearful is no way to live, and it certainly won't help you in many avenues of life.
I won't name names, but I do have concerns about the character of some of the people here. For example, I wouldn't want my kids to be taught by someone who thinks the best way to express oneself is to be aggressive, rude, and with a strength and loudness not supported by any clear argument or apparent intellect whatsoever.
There are several such people on here and it all seems a bit strange to me.
I am a 4-year qualified teacher, well respected by my peers, students and their parents. I am strongly considering spending the next 3-5 years travelling and I am stunned at the character of these threads/conversations and would be interested to see the real-life version. Imagine the faces behind these comments. Imagine their ability to have a civilised conversation, and imagine the behaviour and attitude they would be modelling for children, presuming that they are, in fact, teachers of any repute at all. A bit worrying, regardless of educational context.
Maybe there should be a site where ESL teachers rate schools they have visited... No, wait, we will still just have to read a bunch of nonsense.
Good luck everybody, and make sure you consider your options wisely and appropriately rate the various opinions before taking things on board.