Exalta
- 2007-03-23
All recruiters are liars but only some FTs lie.
Claire O
- 2007-03-19
I agree with Diane, it is obvious that you are a recruiter. If you are so certain of the organization's value and support of their teachers, bolster your credibility by listing references who would happily provide interested parties/the public with their so-called "great" experiences. You have not given TEFL seekers any logical reason to discount her claims.
Stephanie
- 2006-09-25
Dear Mr Latham,
I would just like to tell you something and that is you are wrong on one count. The China Teaching Network DOES NOT always place teachers in licensed and legal schools. If you still would like to dispute this fact than please please tell that to the 3 foreigners including myself that they placed into a primary school in Shanghai. This school was not authorized to hire foreigners and we ended up getting deported out of China. We were dealing with a woman by the name of Helen. When we asked her for her assistance she wouldn't return our phone calls but she made sure that she got paid for her services.
We have all filed complaints against this company and we were told that we were not the first ones.
Maybe you are one of the lucky ones who never got screwed over by them, and if so than that is great. However please don't call the rest of us liars and accuse us of trying to damage an innocent company. Are you a teacher or do you work for them? From your past responses in where you are defending them I think it is the latter..........
fish4esl
- 2006-09-22
It seems to me neither Arnold or Dianne are getting very far with this thread.
Dianne, you've said your piece. Leave it at that. Recruitment/HR/management agencies have the right to be in business; if they conduct their business--or themselves--they will eventually put themselves out of business. The posts and threads here and elsewhere about recruters are too numerous to count. And I would guess that since most of the potential TEFL teachers thinking of going abroad will find their ways to an internet forum or two to see what's up with it.
Arnold, don't give her or anybody else any more reason to sink their nails into you. It just becomes free bad advertising. If you really are conducting your business properly you'll get plenty of return business and word-of-mouth referals. It must be immensely difficult to operate your business in the environment that you've put yourself; don't make it any more difficult for yourself by responding on a personal basis to attacks on you.
For everybody else, there's an excellent article here in ESL T.B. that can be used as a primer to entering China as a TEFL teacher written by "Dos" titled "Laowai thinking of coming to China to teach English." New posters that are looking for advice can be reffered to this article first.
Arnold Latham
- 2006-09-22
How nave, it is obvious you have an axe to grind, what a pleasant little excuse. The other email addresses came from the same server, that is, they came from the SAME PLACE and SAME PERSON.
For you to suggest that they came from different people sharing computers is laughable, at best, bordering on deceitful.
I say again, to readers, make up your own mind by contacting The Network yourselves and experience their professional approach the teacher placement in authorized, licensed schools.
Dianne
- 2006-09-22
Dear Mr. Arnold Latham,
There are more unhappy teachers on www.marksesl.com.
Sometimes, teachers share a computer in the teachers`office or in their flat. I am in this situation this term. Last year, I had a computer in my individual flat. I accepted my present job, because I don`t need a computer very often.
Actually, those complaints about schools without the licence to employ foreign teachers are more serious.
Arnold Latham
- 2006-09-21
Now do you really expect people to take this garbage on marksesl.com seriously, below is an example of where these posts came from ONE PERSON with an axe to grind, because The Network advertised for some teachers from the African continent last year, I have rung The Networks office this morning to obtain the full story.
So if you are basing your decisions on such information, well??????????
Alex P (222.185.234.18)
G.D (222.185.234.18)
Mark (222.185.234.18)
I.G (222.185.234.18)
ESL teacher (222.185.234.18)
Mark (222.185.234.18)
As I say again, apply and see for yourself what a professional group this is.
This year they have already placed over 800 teachers throughout China, and whilst they would like a 100% approval rating, that is simply not possible, given the nature of some teachers coming to China.
I maintain, and do the vast, vast majority of teachers placed that The China Teaching Network is professional in the manner in which they place teachers and we are all grateful for their on going support.
Enough said
Arnold Latham
- 2006-09-21
You obviously have not used the services of The Network. You have an ulterior motive for posting, and I would urge readers to view your posts as such.
The poster you refer to on Marks is one person, check the email addresses, it is one person.
As always, I would say, don't take my word for the professional services offered by The Network, apply to them yourself and you will find they are very professional and place teachers in authorised, licensed schools.
Dianne
- 2006-09-20
I didn`t use other names to post on www.marksesl.com.
This is your way, not mine. Chinese recruiters are doing this very often as well.
Recruitment agencies in China are not serious at all. Whenever I asked the help of a recruiter, I had to check the schools and teachers` flats by myself. It`s very hard to find out, if a school has the licence to employ foreign teachers. ( just if one is lucky enough to meet a former teacher )
When almost 10 foreigners were unhappy with your service ( on www.marksesl.com ), how can you be still optimistic ?
From your last answer, is very clear that you are just a recruiter. Why don`t you write the truth then ? I don`t want to open an old can of worms on this site, but you don`t have the right attitude. How can one trust your honest recruitment business ?
Arnold Latham
- 2006-09-19
Good point made, so just a short follow up, as all good businesses are aware, providing optimal service to their csutomers is essential.
So it is with The China Teaching Network, the service and support network provided to their teachers is first class, so I would say to all readers, just find out for yourselves and you will find that The Network is professional, friendly and very supportive.
fish4esl
- 2006-09-18
I hope this thread doesn't turn into one of those bickering things back and forth. Seems just like all other disagreements in life, truth and accuracy is somewhere in between the two.
I've never used a recruiter in ESL job placements, so I have no direct experience with it. But I think the point of a recruiter, and there are recruiters in every industry, is to give people an option, and a starting point. To get as much info about as many places as possible without having to do all the leg work yourself. Of course a recuiter will steer a client to a particular group of employers; thats how they earn their money. It is a business, after all.
Quite often in these threads the recurrent theme is over contract disputes. Unfortunately, often TEFL teachers are young and relatively inexperienced in business or contract negotiation, so often times they get "taken." (That also is the nature of business. Who ever negotiates better, gets the profit. Have you ever bought a new car, tried to get good value for a trade-in, and get a car loan to buy the car? Steep learning curve the first time, isn't it?) I'm not condoning abject dishonesty or deceit, but somewhere along the way we all need to remember this is business, and people want to make as much profit as they can. Recruiters use teachers as product, and managers/emloyers see teachers as tools to an end. And teachers want to earn as big of a paycheck as possible. And contracts are generally gap fill documents, and are negotiable. Also, when you arrive on the site to sign all the documents in person, be sure to get an original set for yourself, signed and dated with all the red and blue stamps on them, for your safe keeping, not photocopies. (Keep the original residence permit, your passport, etc. also. It is YOUR permit, nobody elses.)
There's a steep wisdom/learning curve to all this, and--just like anywhere in business--you need to watch out for your own best interests. Nobody else will!
Arnold Latham
- 2006-09-18
Utter nonsense, upon investigating your email(s) it is obvious that you are posting under a number of names, only to discredit this legal, authorised an licensed company.
You are a serial poster, with an axe to grind, you cannot even name the correct manangers of the company, you have not appied to them for work, or you would have received numerous courteous emails in reply.
To all concerned, take note, and take whatever this poster has to without even a grain of salt, he is the ONE person behind all the negative posts on Marks and other sites.
My advice to all reading this is find ou6tt for yourself what The China Teaching Network is all about, and you will find as over 3000 teachers placed here in China by them have found, that they are extremely professional in the way they introduce and look after their teachers.
Last year, I sent an e-mail to this company, asking also some details about their activity in the recruiting field. I got a very unpolite answer from Chris Ryndall, the big potato, there.( not John or someone else )
Later on, checking more sites I found a big number of unhappy teachers especially on www.marksesl.com ( forums-black and white lists ). Some of these teachers were even sent to schools without the right licence. How to get a work visa in such a case ?
My personal opinion is that Arnold Latham and others with positive opinions are part of the team in Wuhan. ( recruiters, not teachers )